Guardian not wrong to say Tel Aviv is Israel’s capital, UK press complaints panel decides | The Times of Israel

andyboy100 · 2012-05-24T20:51:30.252453+00:00

Israel can't force the Guardian or the International community to recognize it's claims to Jerusalem.

Of course not. But the Guardian or the international community has no right to force Israel to change anything, and to present Tel Aviv as Israel's capital is a plain lie.

andyboy100 · 2012-05-24T20:38:07.528888+00:00

So basically: first you claim that there is legal basis for surrender of Jerusalem then when I show you it isn't so you change the argument to hide behind the backs of five billion people for whom you are an authentic representative and with whom no argument can be had, and once you're in the corner, you call me names.

I highly suggest you validate the veracity of your logic by randomly picking up a person on the street to be your doctor next time you need a surgery. After all, five billion people can't be wrong.

namer98 · 2012-05-24T20:25:35.074420+00:00

If they oppose existence of Israel, or submit baseless demands such as withdrawal to 1949 borders, then that's the definition of anti-Israeli activism. And lately I've been seeing more and more overt antisemitism and plain lies disguised as "criticism" because apparently whereever the freedom of speech is allowed, all speech becomes equal and a meticulously researched historiographic work deserves just as much attention as a dozen of fabricated arbitrary lies.

lazelon · 2012-05-24T20:22:28.491391+00:00

Israeli law also would prevent him to live with his wife in Israel if she was Syrian or Lebanese. And for the same reason too. There is a war going on.

And why doesn't he tell us what would happen to HIM if he crossed over to Palestinian Authority to live with his wife while retaining his Israeli citizenship? I wonder if he even contemplated this scenario?

Today, a Jew from any country can move to Israel, while a Palestinian refugee, with a valid claim to property in Israel, cannot.

The validity of these claims became a big question the moment Arabs - including Palestinians - decided to try and go with a little judenrein in the best of Hitler's style. Isn't it fascinating that for political purposes they demand to be treated as a whole people, but for claims against Israel they're suddenly discriminated individuals who bear no liability for what their people did, and that their wives aren't being granted exceptional treatment as if they were not citizens in an entity with which we are more or less at war?

andyboy100 · 2012-05-24T16:21:25.626665+00:00

When you have the representatives of the other 5 billion people on the planet in agreement with you, then you might have a case. Until then, you only have cult members.

You really don't understand the concepts of state immunity, self-determination and national independence, do you? Remember this scene in a movie: "Benzi, im kulam kofzim mihagag..."? Popular opinion and international consensus do not determine anything. There is one and only instance in which international community may intervene in internal affairs of states and that is gross ("grave breach") and systematic violations of human rights. Israeli capital is where Israel says it is, and there is no further discussion to be had on the subject.

Now let's get back to the things you chose to remove from your response. You claimed falsely and without basis that Israel was under legal duty to subject Jerusalem to a corpus separatum regime. Are you going to admit that you were wrong? You also claimed, based on the above, that the international community hitherto gets to decide what is or isn't Israeli capital. Are you going to admit that you were wrong on this too?

andyboy100 · 2012-05-24T15:43:44.842189+00:00

Fuck these people with a rake.

BoiledGizzard · 2012-05-24T15:40:16.784500+00:00

So basically, until pigs are airborne?

andyboy100 · 2012-05-24T15:39:31.917595+00:00

The it's 'non-binding' defense

The 'non-binding defense' as you call it applies to non-binding things.

seems to vanish when it comes to Arab incursions in '48,

Yes? In which way does it "seem to vanish"?

either way, there is an overwhelming consensus arrived at by the international community regarding Jerusalem.

There is an overwhelming consensus between I, Kaffir and jordan_is_palestine that you should donate $5000 to Im Tirzu.

Are you donating yet?

BoiledGizzard · 2012-05-24T15:36:53.588006+00:00

Dunno. I've seen a fat frecha once going through the doorway talking on her cellphone. She stopped by the door, touched the mezuza with her phone, kissed the phone and went on talking.

Revolution_rnt · 2012-05-24T15:34:55.978590+00:00

I was mocking the people who allude to the terrible woes of the poor migrants, and specifically the bullshit argument we hear from Kav La-Oved and the bleeding hearts at Haaretz et al that the crimes they commit are out of desperation, because the main outrage is about the violent crimes such as rape. If this is still too difficult for you, let me spell it out slowly and in bold capital letters.

MY MAIN POINT WAS, AS YOU SAID, THAT PEOPLE DON'T RAPE TO FEED THEMSELVES.

beauseph · 2012-05-24T15:20:03.288347+00:00

Well, I guess that's a polite way of saying that the politicians are corrupt and would rather sit on their ass than actually doing their job.

andyboy100 · 2012-05-24T15:17:06.043463+00:00

So basically, you pulled it out of your ass, and despite the fact that none of Israeli claims are based on UNGAR 181 (as opposed to the binding nature of San Remo convention and the Mandate and other legal instruments) you now want me to believe that 181 is the sole source of Israeli claims and therefore these claims are null.

Is this correct?

Revolution_rnt · 2012-05-24T15:14:14.613143+00:00

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sarcasm

beauseph · 2012-05-24T14:16:01.103465+00:00

thanks for adding that Mike, though I'm sure that's true of any desirable place to live in any country. NYC solved this problem with mass transit to help decentralize the population.

"Subway in Tel-Aviv" is an ongoing Israeli joke that's been going for good 20 years now.

I wonder if Israel's recent commuter train addition had any real impact on the housing distribution at all - like did any town along the new train's path have any housing uptick.

The rail development is very slow, and as it often impinges on special interests (do you know why there's still no railways to Eilat?), it is obstructed. Besides, it is indecently expensive.

I wonder how much apartment warehousing is unique to Israel and may need to be discouraged. There is a significant percentage of apartments that go empty most of the year as investments by tourists and pensioners. In my family 10% of the housing my extended family owns is empty on any day of the year.

It's quite the opposite. Because the housing cost is so high (again because of underlying taxation and mortgage business), real estate is treated like well-appreciating investment. An investor doesn't care if they overpay $100K if the ROI is the same, and leasing isn't necessarily worth it. This further drives up property prices out of reach of the middle class. On the other hand, people tend to take an apartment on mortgage and lease it, effectively having other people pay their mortgage installments. It's a known axiom that rent value tends to approach monthly mortgage installment value. Everybody profits except for people who don't have their own place.

Revolution_rnt · 2012-05-24T14:09:04.880966+00:00

Naaaw. You think?!

BoiledGizzard · 2012-05-24T13:05:02.784455+00:00

When will you learn that this prohibition is UNACCEPTABLE IN MODERN SOCIETY?

BoiledGizzard · 2012-05-24T13:02:55.677281+00:00

We have a charedi lady working for us. The fingerprint reader that calculates work hours has a built in RFID frob reader. Everyone has RFID frobs that open the main door. The management refuses to let people to use frobs to sign in/out and forces everybody to identify through the fingerprint, with the argument that people would cheat by handing over their frobs to someone else when not actually showing up for work. The charedi lady is the only exception, because she won't touch the fingerprint reader if the last person who scanned was a man.

PrinceDakkar · 2012-05-24T12:55:38.421028+00:00

peonunciation

Kaffir · 2012-05-24T11:26:43.338300+00:00

Downvoting anything that paints Israel in positive light or Arabs in negative one has become the norm on this reddit. Case in point

andyboy100 · 2012-05-24T11:22:30.381701+00:00

Yes? Where did they accept that? In their acceptance of UNGAR 181? That was a bilateral proposal and the consent to it isn't binding unless entered into treaty by both sides. Was it entered into treaty? No. Was anything mentioned about Jerusalem in the Declaration of Independence, which is the legal instrument expressing voluntary acceptance of some obligations of the partition plan? No.

Kaffir · 2012-05-24T09:57:27.502745+00:00

Nevertheless, the underlying antisemitic meme is that "Jew" is merely a religion, and that there is no individual distinction between Jews, and the compliance to religious law is strict and uniform. In other words, they project on Jewish identity the same attributes that Islam has.

richards1052 · 2012-05-24T02:36:52.607316-07:00

skittymcmahon · 2012-05-24T02:20:40.521474-07:00

[stupid comment removed, wrong netblock]

Revolution_rnt · 2012-05-24T07:55:50.585391+00:00

Yet you have a truckload of very strong opinions. Very interesting. What is your nationality and religion?

Revolution_rnt · 2012-05-24T07:54:01.709508+00:00

רובם ככולם באו לפה כדי לשפר את מצבם הכלכלי כי באפריקה חרא.

אז "פליט" הוא לא אלא מאגר כלכלי.

"אירגוני הסיוע" במימון הקרן החדשה לישמעאל רואים בזה הזדמנות לדלל קצת את הרוב היהודי

אז אותו סיפור כמו מדיניות של לייבור האנגלי. להביא זרים ועל חשבונם (לא באמת, על חשבון אזרח משלם מס) להרחיב את בסיס המצביעים.

אז מישהו שמלווה אותם שם לחש לו באוזן משהו ואז הוא נזכר להגיד למצלמה שהוא גם פליט.

לול, זוכר איזו תוכנית זו הייתה?

MikeSeth

TROPHY CASE

MikeSeth

TROPHY CASE

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