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[–]turnipX 488 points489 points ago

Agreed, file-sharingbay.org.

[–]Blamemeta 178 points179 points ago

actaully, now it's .se

[–]aoeu00 246 points247 points ago

now .se = software exchange

[–]TheSwagtrician 1 point2 points ago

Good stuff, aoeu00; good stuff.

[–]VikingIV 108 points109 points ago

...perhaps goat.se?

[–]StrictlyStupid 46 points47 points ago

oh fuck you

[–]cjay554 19 points20 points ago

Dinner first

[–]cb43569 2 points3 points ago

That actually loses the pun from the original domain name, which was goatse.cx and was supposed to sound like "goat sex" out loud.

[–]acertainpointofview 1 point2 points ago

All these torrents, Terrabytes of ass photos. What the hell have I found?

[–]Crisender111 55 points56 points ago

But only they call it piracy.

[–]mountain-anxiety 43 points44 points ago

Does this mean the original website was operated by actual pirates ?

[–]BurritoBazooka 26 points27 points ago

No. Watch "StealThisFilm". The MPAA set up a "Antipiratbyran" (anti-piracy bureau) in Sweden. So some file sharers set up "Piratbyran" in coy response. Then it grew from there. Piratbyran had a hand in Pirate Bay and Piratenpartei.

[–]a_pet_rock 29 points30 points ago

I always read that as "Anti-Pirate Bryan" and "Pirate Bryan". Poor Bryan has an identity crisis.

[–][deleted] 37 points38 points ago

I'd watch Saving Pirate Bryan.

[–]totallygeeky 10 points11 points ago

It all ends with him going to jail for 10-20 and having massive fines due to file-sharing

[–]z1o2 13 points14 points ago

your post is sad and I feel sad

[–]totallygeeky 6 points7 points ago

The world is a sad place my friend :(

[–]z1o2 1 point2 points ago

Well at least i have a new friend!!!

[–]trackofalljades 1 point2 points ago

Saving Pirate Bryan?

[–]sometimesdouche 1 point2 points ago

Actually, I don't think Piratbyrån was involved in the original Pirate Party.

[–]Dalunatic 1 point2 points ago

*Piratbyrån and *Piratpartiet

[–]FriscoBowie 1 point2 points ago

Yarrrr

[–]antispimmer 41 points42 points ago

I've always considered ThePirateBay's name to be more satirical in nature than anything else. I'm also a dog, however, and I have no idea what I am doing.

[–]patches152 22 points23 points ago

get off the internet, dog. you don't have the mental capacity to comprehend satire and you can't type.

[–]LinksAwakening42 10 points11 points ago

Don't worry, dog. We'll give you a phone call filling you in on the details.

[–]VeryTallTrees 1 point2 points ago

YES

THIS IS DOG

[–]loLotus 11 points12 points ago

Excellent point

[–]Konstiin 88 points89 points ago

But it was 1778. and... I had a letter of marque from the King.

How about Privateering?

[–]keyboard_software 33 points34 points ago

And the RIAA took both me legs?

[–]indies_and_exposure 17 points18 points ago

How I wish I was in Sherbrooke nooooowwww!

[–]casual_complimenter 8 points9 points ago

I hear that's legal Sherbrooke-way.

[–]Spikor 1 point2 points ago

Goddamn them all.

[–]Uncle_Duke 1 point2 points ago

Now I'm a broken man on a Halifax pier....

The last of Svartholm's privateers

[–]rkenned 940 points941 points ago

Calling it file-sharing confuses illegal activities with legal ones. There's no reason to screw over those of us that do torrent things legally.

[–]BarelyComical 87 points88 points ago

We could refer to piracy as "illegal file-sharing".

[–]jmdugan 91 points92 points ago

"copyright infringement" is both accurate and neutral

https://twitter.com/#!/ClearBits/statuses/166232448542310400

[–]deako 38 points39 points ago*

Not in legal circles, since there are many ways to infringe on copyrights without file-sharing.

edit: I guess I should have said that although unlicensed file-sharing is a type of copyright infringement, there are many ways to infringe on copyrights without file-sharing. I should have been clear that I thought copyright infringement was not a precise enough term for speaking about legal matters.

[–]60177756 23 points24 points ago

To be precise, that's not quite accurate: "infringement" is accurate, just not very precise.

[–]passing_interest 2 points3 points ago

I like the way that sentence came out.

[–]fantasticsid 2 points3 points ago

But sharing files you're not authorized to distribute is a copyright infringement.

[–]jmdugan 8 points9 points ago

can you explain this more, I think there may be a point here I can't quite see

what I meant is that when we're talking about people violating the rights assigned by copyright by filesharing, then correct term to describe the action is "copyright infringement". There are highly biased words people use on both sides of the disagreement about that illegal behavior. on the one end "piracy" is slanted to associate the activity with murder and seizing ships on the high seas, and on the other end "file sharing" is biased to make it sound innocuous and harmless.

[–]deako 10 points11 points ago*

Sorry, I didn't mean it wasn't correct; it just isn't accurate precise since copyright-infringement can be used to mean many things. For example, an unlicensed derived work is a form of copyright-infringement without file-sharing or the Internet even being involved.

Edited, with edits made apparent.

[–]Rent-a-Hero 2 points3 points ago

Exactly. File-sharing is one way to infringe on copyright. Saying "copyright infringement" to refer to the online sharing of copyrighted material would not be descriptive enough.

[–]skeeto 75 points76 points ago

Does the legality/illegality influence the moral rightness or wrongness of sharing a file? That is, if sharing a certain file is illegal, does that make it wrong?

[–]rushmc1 153 points154 points ago

The law, you will find, has only an intermittent relationship with morality.

[–]skeeto 45 points46 points ago

My point, exactly.

[–]Zornack 24 points25 points ago

Do you believe copyright infringement and piracy is not wrong?

[–]skeeto 34 points35 points ago*

Copyright infringement is a legal concept, so no, I don't believe copyright infringement itself is wrong. I don't think any action is wrong merely because of its illegality. Just because some corrupt lawmakers decided to violently punish some activity doesn't make it wrong.

I do think freeloading -- enjoying someone's work without contributing to their effort when they're politely asking -- could be considered wrong, but it shouldn't be punished with anything beyond a shaming. I think most "piracy" doesn't fall into this category.

[–]ethicalking 500 points501 points ago*

just so we're clear, this is piracy.

EDIT: immediate down-votes haha, I knew this thread wasn't really about legitimate torrents. But instead, reddit trying to find a way to justify downloading the newest version of the movie footloose for free. Of which there are multiple problems with that.

[–]rkenned 225 points226 points ago

Just so we're clear, this is not. Neither is this, or this.

[–]ethicalking 79 points80 points ago

agreed, I'd defend those sites all day and night.

[–]Kalium 57 points58 points ago

And the MAFIAA will tell you that OCRemix is home to a bunch of evil pirates.

[–]darkrxn 20 points21 points ago

The MPAA/RPAA cannot compete with free independent or classic media. They don't want free literature from 100+ years ago being shared, or free independent music/movie artists. The bourgeois has controlled the means of production with the government's protection for a long time, and now that the proletariat does not need production companies to distribute their media, rich people are going to lose money, and the government will not stand for that. (the money will go to new inventors/creators)

[–]ethicalking 19 points20 points ago

I am sure that you are correct, big media companies do not want to compete with free independent or classic media. But nor do they want to have their personal property rights violated. the fact is that 99% of the content linked to and promoted on tpb is new content produced by those big shitty media companies. people don't have a problem with file-sharing sites that distribute legitimate content from free independent of classic media like this, this or this. But if someone makes a movie called Footloose and doesn't want to give it away for free, then that's their right. And they should be able to protect their personal property rights from a website dedicated do to the exact opposite of that.

[–]MrDectol 2 points3 points ago

Upvoted for high school vocabulary that most people forget about

[–]eight8 13 points14 points ago

Valid argument.

[–]Butorand 1 point2 points ago*

Wow, now if only people defended these sites (maybe excluding link 2) rather than Megaupload and The Pirate Bay.

[–]tylerblack84 84 points85 points ago

it's not the "file sharing" bay.

[–]kbox 39 points40 points ago

Checkmate, pirates.

[–]sarcastic_smartass 173 points174 points ago

Well, we deserve to be able to download whatever we want for free. It's like, you know, because the corporations want to screw us over and stuff. It shouldn't be, like, illegal to take what is rightfully ours anyway, you know man?

[–]Kanin 4 points5 points ago

What problems?

[–]ethicalking 25 points26 points ago

it's Footloose, it's a really shitty movie; why would anyone even want to torrent it?

[–]trevorbest 5 points6 points ago

Upvote for proper use of the semi- colon.

[–]ethicalking 15 points16 points ago

thanks, but if you investigate my semi-colon use further, then you'll realize...

[–]buffalonkey 36 points37 points ago*

As I didn't see Jack Sparrow or Errol Flynn on that list, I'd say that picture has shit to do with piracy.

When a law is rejected by the majority of a population, its days as a law are numbered. People are wising up to copyright abuses and the media industry's nonsense. The funny thing is, they are rolling in mountains of money, and they still can't figure out how to unfuck themselves. Instead they offer the world and their customers inferior product, clumsy content delivery, endless rehashes, unsupportable high prices, feeding the vapid ingrown ass hair which is celebrity culture, a cavalcade of circle jerk award shows, reality tv (shudders), and a boundless sense of entitlement.

Then, at the end of the day have the fucking gal to lobby our government into passing/attempting the most draconian "protection" mechanisms that have ever existed. Pushing this shit in USA and strong arming countries around the world into propping up this culture cancer.

Big content needs to die in a fire, and society would be better off without them.

PS, this is piracy, or maybe scenes from "I'm on a boat - Part II", not sure...

[–]Blue_Collar 53 points54 points ago

When a law is rejected by the majority of a population, its days as a law are numbered.

Do you have any sources showing that the majority of people rejecting copyright infringement? Don't mistake people being against SOPA and PIPA as meaning they support copyright infringement. I would have no issue with countries working together using due process to take down sites that peddle in illegal downloads.

[–]TheMeddlingMonk 9 points10 points ago

[–]Biduleman 15 points16 points ago

Again, Definition of PIRACY

1 : an act of robbery on the high seas; also : an act resembling such robbery

2 : robbery on the high seas

3 a : the unauthorized use of another's production, invention, or conception especially in infringement of a copyright

b : the illicit accessing of broadcast signals

See what is written for 3? Illegal file sharing is named piracy even if you don't like it.

[–]rcsheets 7 points8 points ago

Dictionaries describe how language is used by the masses. The argument being made is that using the word in that way is wrong, not that it isn't popular. We wouldn't be having this conversation at all if the word "piracy" weren't popularly used in sense 3, so the fact that you found it in a dictionary means precisely nothing.

[–]fuxnoise 1 point2 points ago

where's the ransom note?

[–]llII 1 point2 points ago

immediate down-votes haha

you know, downvoted and shiot

[–]cold_fire149 1 point2 points ago

No kidding man! Just look at all the downvotes I got for a legitimate opinion.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points ago

Hey what do you use for music these days? I used to use limewire, then switched to frostwire after it went down. I'm pretty sure there's something better out there, but I've been out of the loop.

[–]ethicalking 2 points3 points ago

lots of stuff out there, grooveshark, pandora and my personal favorite, spotify.

[–]fdasdfsdfad 1 point2 points ago

But I deleted it when I was finished watching.

[–]gorange 1 point2 points ago

I'm with you. Actually, I think that defending, and renaming piracy does a lot of damage. I'm a fierce critic of the music and film industry, but they are right in defending their property using all means available to them. It's up to US to come up with something better, on both the distribution as well as the content side. If you're pirating Footloose, you obviously want to watch it. Well, if there's not as much money in making Footloose, it won't be made the next time. Actually, I think one of the reasons we're getting so much crap recently is in part because of fear in the industry that they'll take a risk on a project, and it will get popular virally but not get them ROI. My two cents.

[–]Dirty0ldMan 1 point2 points ago

You can't reason with a lot of people here. For some reason some people can't handle the thought that a lot of what they're doing is illegal so they try and justify it any way they can.

[–]THEMACGOD 8 points9 points ago*

Then... Add "illegal" in front? File sharing is gooood... Illegal file sharing is badddddd.

[–]jmdugan 1 point2 points ago

"copyright infringement" is both accurate and neutral

https://twitter.com/#!/ClearBits/statuses/166232448542310400

[–]Buffalox 1 point2 points ago

Calling it file-sharing confuses illegal activities with legal ones.

Then just call it illegal file sharing. It is still a more correct term than piracy, which has to do with stealing and killing.

The super correct term would be Copyright infringing file sharing.

[–]madfrogurt 335 points336 points ago

Go to the Pirate Bay and check the top 100 torrents. How many of them are legal?

I'm against SOPA and some of the provisions of ACTA because they unfairly stifle legitimate file sharing. But let's not bullshit ourselves, it's not "file sharing" that's primarily being targeted, it's copyright infringing piracy that's being targeted.

[–]stitchesandlace 2 points3 points ago

This is a stupid question, but what exactly is the difference between "file sharing" and "piracy"? I was under the impression that the way Congress etc are defining piracy includes file sharing as well. Is there a difference?

[–]Kytro 1 point2 points ago

Sharing files is simply sharing files, piracy, in this context means doing so when you don't have the rights to do so.

[–]ethicalking 44 points45 points ago

what the pirate bay does is piracy. And that's what reddit is defending.

[–]bejayel 10 points11 points ago

Reddit really doesn't like being called out on the bad things they do. Same with the stupid bullshit.

According to reddit, DRM exists because of DRM. Then they say they pirate DRM stuff "in order to fight DRM", knowing full well that it only makes the case for DRM even stronger.

99% of the people here who pirate stuff do it because they can. It has nothing to do with "fighting the good fight" and everything to do with "hey, I can get this shit for free".

Every time the topic of piracy comes up, reddit turn in to a bunch of hypocritical douche bags. They make fun of jersey shore douche bags all day long, but fail to realise they are internet douche bags.

[–][deleted] ago

[deleted]

[–]yeswecould 5 points6 points ago

Torrent meta data contains hashes of copyrighted data. I don't understand why application of some arbitrary function (SHA-1) should remove that copyright. What if instead of applying SHA-1 you'd just invert all bits (yet another function). Would you then be able to share that data online and claim it is not protected by the original copyright?

[–]neverforget2 5 points6 points ago

SHA-1 is not invertible. You can't recover the data from a hash.

What if instead of applying SHA-1 you counted the number of 1's in the binary encoding of the data? Would you then be able to claim that number is protected by the original copyright?

[–]solen-skiner 2 points3 points ago*

What if i XOR the bits of my own creations with a Disney movie, who owns the result? Do they own my work as you can get their movie by XORing my work with the resulting file, do I own theirs as the reverse is true as well, or should we accept that copyright is antiqued in a world where making copies is free in both time and money?

Looking forwards into a future where 3d-printers can print with molecular resolution and copies of physical items are as cheap as digital copies, does this state-imposed monopoly help hold our society back or push us forwards?

[–]sdellysse 1 point2 points ago

Interesting point. Actually, a very interesting point. I have not rebuttal yet.

[–]rcsheets 101 points102 points ago

But it's not simply file sharing. There is file sharing that doesn't infringe anyone's copyrights. Why not call it copyright violation? I realize copyright violation can be accomplished through means other than file sharing, but surely the problem is copyright violation in all its forms.

[–]The_Penitent_Man 73 points74 points ago

The Oxford English Dictionary says it's a correct usage of the word. Also, it's been used in this sort of context well before the advent of the internet. If you wanted a different word for unauthorized distribution of content, you should have done something about it 300 years ago.

[–]Spoggerific 10 points11 points ago

For what it's worth, it's not just English that calls it piracy. The term 海賊 (kaizoku) in Japanese literally means piracy (the characters individually mean "ocean" and "robber"), and it's used all the time. Related vocabulary like "pirated edition" (海賊版) use the same base word.

[–]smellofmorningcoffee 13 points14 points ago

According to an online 語源辞典, however, the use of 海賊 to refer to illegal copying/sharing is borrowed directly from the English use of the word "piracy." I feel that only if this was a completely independent use that just happened to derive from the same perspective of file-sharing as marauding, then the Japanese example would have currency in the discussion.

[–]niceville 1 point2 points ago

For what it's worth, dictionaries are de-scriptive, not pre-scriptive. Dictionaries are simply records of the meanings of words as they have been used in the past and not what is the 'correct' meaning.

That's why dictionaries can add 'words' like muggle, lol, and omg - the dictionary is not declaring that these are only now words because they've decreed it, but that these combinations of letters and their pronunciations convey certain meanings.

[–]shnugi 110 points111 points ago

File sharing does not denote if it's legal or not legal. Piracy does.

[–]CraineTwo 21 points22 points ago

"File sharing"= the act of sharing a file

"Legal file sharing"=legal

"Illegal file sharing"= not legal

Using loaded words like "piracy" as an umbrella term for the practice of making electronic data available for public download is misleading and propagandist, even if the people involved embrace the term humorously. When opponents to an idea resort to hyperbolically using negatively connotative words to refer to something they want to abolish, they gain the support of a public who won't question the real issue (i.e. "death tax", "anti-life/choice", "War on Christmas", "Snowpacalypse/mageddon", etc.).

[–]level42somacruz 17 points18 points ago

Nobody uses the term piracy as an umbrella term for making electronic data available for public download. Nobody accuses a website of piracy for serving their own content, unless they believe (or at least claim) that the content infringes on copyright.

[–]jmdugan 19 points20 points ago

exactly

"file sharing" is just as biased language on the other side

"copyright infringement" is both accurate and neutral

https://twitter.com/#!/ClearBits/statuses/166232448542310400

[–]unheimlich 38 points39 points ago

Did you just use Twitter as a source?

[–]jmdugan 2 points3 points ago

just an example of the idea presented

[–]weekendofsound 180 points181 points ago

Yeah, piracy is a little drastic. Only once have I boarded a ship and fought its crew in order to take their precious new album.

[–]wewtaco 31 points32 points ago

Wait, only once? How did you do it the rest of the times? Have I been doing it wrong this whole time?

[–]Thydamine 12 points13 points ago

Paul McCartney can't fight pirates like he used to.

[–]eliasqfuntybunt 1 point2 points ago

Well, he is dead.

[–]Epistaxis 25 points26 points ago

"Bootlegging" has a much more charming, Prohibition-era ring to it. Except for, you know, organized crime.

[–]ShastaMcShasta 25 points26 points ago

"Bootlegging" has its own definition, separate from "file-sharing". Bootlegs are concerts/unreleased material that are recorded by the audience and traded between fans. This can be accepted or disliked by the band, and regardless is a legal gray area. Typically, as long as someone isn't selling the material and/or passing it off as a legitimate release, it's fine. Led Zeppelin, the Grateful Dead, and Pink Floyd have huge bootlegging communities, by the looks of it.

[–]mickeyquicknumbers 3 points4 points ago

Bob Dylan has his own bootleg series!!

[–]ShastaMcShasta 2 points3 points ago

Actually, it was the official release of "The Basement Tapes" that got me into both The Band and Dylan. I'd like to see more artists follow Bob Dylan's lead

[–]mickeyquicknumbers 1 point2 points ago

Oh, I mean completely apart from the basement tapes. He has an 8-series set of bootlegs that are absolutely fantastic.

But I agree, I'd love to see more artists doing that.

[–][deleted] ago

[deleted]

[–]wcc445 1 point2 points ago

If you don't want anyone recording your music at shows, ask them not to. If this doesn't make them hate you, and you still don't want shows being recorded, stop playing them. If you're in it for the money, get the fuck out.

[–]Phunt555 1 point2 points ago

If only it was that easy

[–]Wise_Guy_57 82 points83 points ago

So we can't call it stealing because it isn't technically stealing, and we don't want to make pirates feel like they're doing anything wrong. Now we can't call it piracy because you happened to notice that, "Hey, the term 'piracy' doesn't exactly have stellar connotations either."

So of course, file-sharing is the correct term, what with the ease at which you can refute anyone who argues against it just by saying, "Hey, file-sharing isn't illegal, only if the material is copyrighted."

And, by the way, the term "piracy" has been in use in roughly the modern capacity since 1603, which actually predates modern copyright law (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copyright_infringement#.22Piracy.22).

[–][deleted] ago

[deleted]

[–]dakru 11 points12 points ago

Like others, I think its stealing. Stealing doesn't require something to be missing, it doesn't require anything but acquiring something that isn't yours and isn't legally able to be yours without an authorized transfer from the person from who it belongs to.

The United States Supreme Court doesn't seem to agree with you:

The phonorecords in question were not "stolen, converted or taken by fraud" for purposes of [section] 2314. The section's language clearly contemplates a physical identity between the items unlawfully obtained and those eventually transported, and hence some prior physical taking of the subject goods. Since the statutorily defined property rights of a copyright holder have a character distinct from the possessory interest of the owner of simple "goods, wares, [or] merchandise," interference with copyright does not easily equate with theft, conversion, or fraud. The infringer of a copyright does not assume physical control over the copyright nor wholly deprive its owner of its use. Infringement implicates a more complex set of property interests than does run-of-the-mill theft, conversion, or fraud.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dowling_v._United_States_(1985)

[–]Phonda 23 points24 points ago

While piracy surely is file-sharing, file-sharing is not necessarily piracy.

[–]rncole 13 points14 points ago

Alrighty, here we go. I'm usually on the side of "don't steal" when it comes to music, movies, etc.

HOWEVER, events today just pissed me off. See, my wife and I are going on a 3-week long road trip this month in an RV. It's a rental, and we're flying to and from the rental locations. Therefore, bringing the discs themselves is not ideal.

We plan to bring a selection of DVD's in ripped form from our collection - this is even considered a "grey area" of legality.

Regardless, we own a few Blu-ray discs, one of which that my wife wanted to bring to watch. I thought "great, digital copy included!" when I grabbed the disc. Same thing as Star Trek, that I'd just finished importing. I stick the disk in, iTunes opens, and I enter the code. No dice.

Turns out, the included digital copy, i.e. ON THE DISC, "expired" March 31st 2011. This was preordered, so its not like it was a secondhand disc - I just never thought to import the digital copy as I didn't need to waste disk space on my computer for it.

Ah though, ripping the disk is a (somewhat legal) option! Turns out that internet speeds have gotten sufficiently fast that it's actually quicker to DOWNLOAD the movie than to rip it myself. There's no incentive to stay legal.

What the movie studios WANT though, is for me to just re-purchase the movie in digital form. But, why they hell would I purchase the same movie twice?

[–]VirtualNinjas 66 points67 points ago

Maybe we can call it "freeloading" -- it is more accurate than "piracy"

[–]LonelyVoiceOfReason 10 points11 points ago

Freeloading on NonRival goods.

[–]TheScriptKiddie 1 point2 points ago

So, not-free not-loading?

[–]anonymousredditor999 46 points47 points ago*

You can call it stealing, piracy, file-sharing, borrowing, or whatever the fuck you want. You can make all the moral justifications in the world to make yourself feel better.

But at the end of the day, I'm going to take all the stuff I want because its free and I wont get caught. Fuck all the excuses, I just want free shit. I don't care who is and isn't getting paid. I don't care if they come up with a "better business model". No business model they can come up with will compete with free. You all might feel better about yourselves coming up with excuse after excuse about why you take shit, but at the end of the day you do it because it's free. So do I. I just don't need to take the time to come up with a bunch of moral justifications and get patted on the back by a bunch of punks that I'll never meet who don't even have the balls to say that they're just taking shit for free because they fucking can.

Upvote or downvote me all you want, but you all know it's the fucking truth -- you take shit because you can and you won't get caught. It might sound good on Reddit, but you couldn't care less about all the "sticking it to the man" circlejerking that people do to justify it. You just want free shit. The only difference between you and me is that at least I've got enough balls to admit that no matter what you do or what you come up with, I'm just going to pirate your shit anyway because you cannot compete with free.

[–][deleted] 7 points8 points ago

Upvoted for being honest about it being "wrong" and doing it anyway.

[–]eliasqfuntybunt 14 points15 points ago

I don't agree with piracy, but I appreciate your honesty. You absolutely nailed it.

[–]Atario 2 points3 points ago

I love when people pretend to be on the opposite side of the argument, then try to come off as assholish as possible to set up a massive straw-man. Well done.

[–]RearmintSpino 14 points15 points ago

The sites themselves aren't helping your argument with names like Pirate Bay

[–]Atario 1 point2 points ago

They took the name mockingly. Duh?

[–]TheMountainThatRides 10 points11 points ago

It's "file copying" not "sharing." If I "share" my sandwich with you, i'm left with half a sandwich, not two.

[–]yacob_uk 2 points3 points ago

Your example is correct as your sandwich is a finite resource, bounded by the scarce resource paradigm.

I can "share" a story with you. We both have the memories of the story.

Sharing is still an applicable world in the digital space, that does not infer a reduction of some base resource.

[–]Batmang404 10 points11 points ago

There's illegal and legal file sharing. Piracy is just used for the illegal acts of file sharing

[–]jackattack502 4 points5 points ago

Next week,

We rename drug-dealers unlicensed pharmacists

[–]wackywabbit 17 points18 points ago

i grew up prior to the cd / mp3 era, back then we made tapes off the radio. i really never understood why now people get jail, 20k fines, for shit they would of recorded onto a tape and given it to there gf, bf, friend, neighbor, etc.

most illegally downloaded songs are the same songs on the radio over and over again, what has this turned into.......

[–]johnkong 29 points30 points ago

Stop trying to act like you're entitled to stolen content because it isn't tangible.

[–]meatwad75892 2 points3 points ago

Sharing is caring!

[–]xume 2 points3 points ago

Have you ever heard of anyone arrested for sharing a book with someone?

[–]SDream 2 points3 points ago

I suggest "the-file-multiplication-miracle.church".

People would have to respect it if we say it is our religion/faith that good things (books, movies, porn - good stuff!) that can be multiplied to 7 billion with a click of the mouse should just be multiplied, simple as that. We could say that God himself told us somehow and that if our faith isn't valid then they'd better at least start legalizing gay rights, continuing the cience experiments with human cells (trunk-cells?) and ignore the other religions "problems" as well.

[–]robeph 2 points3 points ago

There is a problem herein. Piracy implies file sharing that has a component of copyright infringement. File sharing itself, does not always need meet this criteria. Both cases, while file sharing, are not the same and distinctly different. It has always been called piracy,

Regardless of what you feel about people's intellectual property rights (I assure you I've probably taken part in plenty of this since the late 80s, although these days I'm mostly just a leech) the term piracy fits. It isn't the same as high-water piracy of a yacht full of rich monocle waring British fox hunters who are out for a jolly good time, but it is the term that has existed since piracy has existed in the software world. It isn't a meme, it is THE term that refers to actions of the whole Scene. I imagine it was used in this context before you could even speak.

[–]Mr_Titicaca 16 points17 points ago

Haven't we gone over this again? It's constantly been proven that those who torrent/download/"pirate" are more likely to go out and buy products related to what they're seeing. People that weren't going to hear/see the product to begin with won't do it anyway, so the companies aren't really losing money. If I love an artist, I may get a few songs here and there online. But if I see the effort and thoroughly enjoy what I heard, I will go out of my way to buy it because I want it in my personal collection. How is it not considered "robbery" for a label to market the shit out of an artist and put out an awesome single, only for the CD to be utter and 100% pure shit???? How is that not illegal? That is not deceptive marketing, but it's lazy. Labels have done this for years, saving top songs for the next album while we buy their shitty CDs.

[–]weekendofsound 1 point2 points ago

I really wish I had seen this before posting a number of very long winded responses. Shit.

[–]Uniquitous 17 points18 points ago

The terms are pretty much synonymous these days. The mental link between "File Sharing" and "Piracy" is immediate. The linguistic war has been lost.

[–]RobDinsmore 5 points6 points ago

Yes. I was listening to an account of the recent rescue of Americans from Somali "Pirates" and the first thing that came to mind was file sharing. Even though I knew they were talking about real Pirates.

[–]ImperialSpaceturtle 1 point2 points ago

They'll probably soon begin referring to [actual] pirates with some other name, like 'maritime gangsters'.

[–]aig_ma 9 points10 points ago

The linguistic war has been lost.

It's only lost if you give up. Why give up? They are synonymous, but the bad connotation of "piracy" gives it a very different connotation, and making the switch would have a big effect in the minds of the ill-informed.

[–]kookla 2 points3 points ago

Seriously, dude. If I see a story about piracy there better be a parrot.

[–]FilterOutBullshit3 39 points40 points ago

No, it's piracy. Taking copyrighted materials for yourself the belong to others is piracy. Don't drag down legitimate file-sharing with your illegal activities.

[–]ubergeek404 61 points62 points ago*

Stop calling it "murder" and start calling it "social culling".

Stop calling it "success" and start calling it "unfairness".

Stop calling it "freedom" and start calling it "instability".

Stop calling it "slavery" and start calling it "safety".

Stop calling it "taxes" and start calling it "contributions".

Stop calling it "charity" and start calling it "entitlement".

Stop calling it "socialism" and start calling it "liberalism".

[–]elfuu 4 points5 points ago

Stop calling it "greed" and start calling it "lost profit".

Stop calling it "propaganda" and start calling it "public relations".

Stop calling it "corruption" and start calling it "lobbying".

Stop calling it "blackmail" and start calling it "international negotiations".

[–]johnkong 23 points24 points ago

Thank you for this. I hate how the OP is trying to manipulate people into thinking something that isn't okay is okay by changing the name of it.

[–]Atario 1 point2 points ago

You mean how the content cartel has?

[–]DadWasntYourMoms1st 21 points22 points ago

While I agree that 'piracy' isn't stealing, I'm a little shocked by the self-entitlement of people like you who try to defend it. Sure, it's not as bad as some make it out to be, but you're not entitled to 'share' these things.

[–]xdzgor 4 points5 points ago

For instance, whenever I hear about "Somalian pirates" I keep wondering what music or videos they're illegally copying and distributing.

[–]IronChuck 21 points22 points ago

There's been a lot of arguing over semantics, in this thread, for sure. In many ways, semantics seem to be the root of the justification for a lot of this.

But, as a cartoonist, Internet contributor, and working to get his Graphic Design degree SO HE CAN MAKE A BETTER LIVING DOING HIS CRAFT, I feel compelled to (Long windedly) comment... down votes be damned.

Whether, or not, "piracy" is the right term, it's still theft.

Sure, you could argue that it can't be theft, since the original hasn't been stolen, per say. But theft is happening when you take my work - as an example - and offer it for free, without my permission, and rob me of the possibility of earning from my work and effort.

And the asinine argument that you shouldn't have to pay for things from huge corporations because they cost too much and those corporations have too much money? Wow; try again, guys. That, too, is still theft.

Mind you, I think things like Photoshop, and Office Suite, are massively, and ridiculously, over priced. Obviously price gouging is taking place. And, in a lot of cases, using Intellectual Property (IP) theft as their justification. (The total cost of a CD - packaging, and all - is as low as $.05 per unit, now. Prices are still what they were over a decade ago. RIAA is quick to claim "piracy" as the cause for high prices; not the crappy, formulaic music being pumped out with little, or no artistic intent other than to score our hard earned cash.)

If you don't like the company, record label, software company, whatever, then don't buy from them. Use Open Office instead of Office Suite. Buy from indie music labels, or from your favorite local bands, directly, instead of the commercial fed noise from RIAA establishments. Subscribe to Netflixs instead of enduring what has become the horrors of modern cinema.

These options not only save you money, headaches, and grief, but tell corporations exactly what you, the public really want, and will actually pay for; IN THEIR OWN PROFIT BASED LANGUAGE.

And providers? Yeah, you're going to learn how to put away the old 20th century business model, and move up into the future with the rest of us. Use you business savvy, here. You're going to need to let go of your greed. You're going to need to start offering better content, at better prices. You're going to need to get back to actually working to provide us with something we're willing to pay for; not just expecting we ought to be buying whatever you're selling.

I, in no way, support corporate sponsored, greed based Internet censorship. SOPA, PIPA, and ACTA are the proverbial wolf in sheep's clothing, for sure. And, as others, I can see there's more going on here than just the battle of the greedy versus the self entitled.

I also must recognize that not all file-sharing is bad. I, myself, use a file sharing site to send work back and forth with my partners, so that we can complete illustrations and other endeavors that I legally own. What happened to Megaupload is, at best, a disgusting perversion of the legal system. And should be a warning to us all about the alignment of law and corporate greed.

Look, deep wallets and Capitol Hill are a frightening combination, yes. And, thanks to the efforts of Disney, and other entertainment powerhouses, copyright has gotten twisted and perverted a great deal in the past fifty years. Creative efforts, and the values we give them, do need to be addressed; as well as ownership and owner retention.

But, we still need to be clear; call it "piracy", or "file-sharing" or what have you, but theft is still theft. Just because I, or anyone else, makes it, you do not have the automatic right to copy and just give it away. When you do that, you are taking from us the ability to earn from our work. You are stealing from us the ability to not only feed, cloth, and live, but the ability to even continue to create and provide the content you wanted, in the first place.

Your greed, the flip side of their greed, will have the exact same effect; the killing of the creative community and the death of positive, independent, and thoughtful content. You're helping to foster the same mindless wasteland that large corporations do, already.

Food for thought: Megaupload was in the process of creating a music sharing system that would have seen artists paid for their work, even if it was a free download, or not. It had the support of many A-level chart placing singers. it wad doing right by those that did right by it. And that's when the labels moved against it; pushing buttons on suspicions and estimates, and not hard fact and due process. They were about to lose another ounce of control - a threat to their wallets, and perceived power.

Shouldn't we be focusing more on that, then whether or not you feel entitled to watch "Footloose" for free because, after all, it was a crappy movie. (And, really, what kind of mature argument is that, to begin with?!)

Let the down voting commence...

[–]Ekutah 1 point2 points ago

Maybe if we could arrange for Letters of Marque we could call it privateering and no one would have to get arrested.

[–]khast 1 point2 points ago

Yeah, "fair-use" has also gone the way of the dodo as well. Ripping a DVD for personal use is considered as piracy, even though you never share it. Ripping a CD for personal use is piracy, Book publishers consider libraries as pirates....ect.

[–]jmdugan 1 point2 points ago*

there's a range of slant possible,

on the one end, there's "piracy"

close, but still as inaccurate is "stealing" and "theft"

in the middle, there's "copyright infringement"

slightly leaning to the other side is "bootlegging"

and on the other end, there's "file sharing"

everyone has their own bias, and their language reflects it clearly.

http://twitter.com/#!/ClearBits/statuses/166232448542310400

[ in my personal opinion, calling copyright infringement "file sharing" is just as biased on the other end as calling it "piracy" ]

[–]Reagan2012 1 point2 points ago

More like file-copying. The file in "file-sharing" is not really shared. It is copied. "File-sharing" implies that multiple users are using a single file.

[–]TheCornbread 1 point2 points ago

Yesterday I went to the flea market with my brother and we both noticed that several stands do sell movies. It is so shady, they take people to the back to show them the newest films that are in theaters. We even witnessed a customer that asked for the new Mission Impossible and the guy selling it freaked out and told him "whoa not here, come with me to the back."

Anyway, to me and my brother, that is piracy.

[–]erehllort 1 point2 points ago

I suggest "file-caring" since sharing a file, in a sense, preserves it for the future by spreading it. and 'cause sharing means caring, and caring means sharing, and sharing means caring, and that's how sharing works.

[–]ContrarianSciencePhD 1 point2 points ago

Yeah, fuckn' A. And remember this before you put up a post asking everyone to help out your artist friend get justice because a bar is using one of their pictures on their website. Or a magazine is using stuff from their blog, or someone is using one of their band's songs.

Because your friend's work doesn't belong to him/her once they put it out there. Art belongs to the people, man. Power to the people.

[–]Mullinator 1 point2 points ago

I like to imagine file-sharing of all kinds in a similar vein to replicators on Star Trek.

I wonder if manufacturers of physical products would bitch as much about someone replicating a car if we had that kind of technology.

"You wouldn't steal a car!"

"Actually I'll just make a copy of it with this machine here..."

"NOOOOOO"

[–]happyscrappy 1 point2 points ago

You just perpetuating the euphemism carousel. The real issue isn't what words others use, you just don't like what they are saying.

If you want to change things, change the discourse, not the words used.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points ago

The only reason SOPA exists in the first place is because of assholes like PirateBay and Megaupload. We wouldn't have to worry about it being misused if there weren't such blatant thieves. If a Swedish site is going to pirate so much American Copyrighted work they should be subject to the law that protects it.

The worst part of all of this of course is the pirates that actually think they are doing a good deed by pirating so they can ignore the fact they are lazy thieves.

[–]scoooot 1 point2 points ago

I agree with the sentiment. Let's call a spade a spade.

It's not "piracy", it's not "file-sharing"...

It's "copyright infringement"

[–]DarkGamer 1 point2 points ago

Copyright infringement.

[–]CutCut 1 point2 points ago

Piracy is technically copyright infringement, but copyright infringement is really copyright appropriation. Piratebay users are essentially claiming the right to make copies for their own use.

But the copyright holder has the monopoly to the copyright, it's their exclusive right and only they can give others a legal license to make copies. This rule is intended to foster more creation in the future. Making a movie is pretty damn expensive after all, and the creators need to make their money back.

Their copyright lets them effectively discriminate against different groups of customers. Those who put a higher value on the media can't get it at the same price as those who put a very low value on it (and are willing to wait to hear it on the radio or watch it on tv).

[–]Otaku-sama 1 point2 points ago

Then it would be hard for the MPAA to demonize us! We wouldn't want that would we?

[–]flopus 1 point2 points ago

Stop calling it "piracy" and start calling it "booty acquisition"

Alternatively, Stop calling it "kidnapping" and start calling it "crew acquisition"

doesn't change what it is

[–]BrainSlurper 1 point2 points ago

I am going to call it copyright infringement for the same reason I don't call stealing "sharing without asking them".

[–]astitious2 1 point2 points ago

I would only call it piracy if someone is making a profit off of someone else's work. Most people call that capitalism though.

I see no problem with file sharing. If you are charging people for distribution, and someone is willing to do it for free, then you need a new business model. Quit being a douche and creating more government so that your prehistoric business model can succeed.

I don't get people that rage against file sharing. I think they are moronic.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points ago

Scumbag Hollywood.

Glorifies piracy

Vilifies piracy

[–]ryanasimov 1 point2 points ago

I want to use all your things, but I don't want to pay you. Share them with me. I won't keep them and you weren't going to sell them to anyone else, so it's not a loss to you.

[–]deako 1 point2 points ago

Piracy has several definitions. The first and most obvious being piracy on the high seas. But what exactly does that mean in itself? It means the illegal diversion and re-appropriation of resources by taking them away from someone else, while they were in transit.

The second comes from a time not too long ago, when technologies allowed for mass dissemination of a broadcast medium. I am of course talking about pirate radio and pirate tv. In this case, the thing being stolen is the broadcast channels, which were portioned out by the government to public and private licensed broadcasters. The pirate station was the one that broadcast on a channel, without permission or license to do so, and thus usurp the use of that channel. In this case, it can be somewhat safely linked to the first definition of piracy, since by "stealing" a channel or frequency illegally, they are prohibiting the legal use of that channel or frequency, at least as long as they had a stronger signal. Big media was of course against it, since the pirate stations were effectively competition, whether or not the operators of the pirate station broadcast on a channel that was in use by someone else.

Now the third, and most recent "re-definition" of piracy. In this third case, nothing is being stolen except for potential sales. This in a way is a drastic change from any former definition of piracy. In the first definition, goods and resources were stolen. In the second is at least the stealing of a resources, the resource being the media resource broadcast channel. But in the third, nothing really tangible is being stolen.

That's not to say that piracy doesn't have an effect on sales, it's just that the effect is positive for some vendors and negative for other vendors. In fact, the vendors getting hurt the most are the ones that rely on marketing and advertising more, and the ones that depend more on word-of-mouth are getting the benefits (ie: more attention and more sales) of dissemination through file-sharing. And the people that depend on advertising the most? Well, that is Big Media, because since they are already in control of traditional broadcast media, advertising campaigns launched with broadcasts media as an advertising platform is relatively cheap for them.

TL;DR piracy as file-sharing is a major departure from previous uses of the word, and wouldn't have been that way if not for Big Media.

[–]MashedPeas 1 point2 points ago

I call it backup.

[–]_phedex 1 point2 points ago

it is piracy - what, do you really think all of us who download copyright software are that innocent?

[–]jag149 1 point2 points ago

Okay, I'd like someone to change my mind on this:

Taking intellectual property that you didn't pay for and that you don't have a license for is not lawful. (Whether it's "theft", "unjust enrichment", "conversion", etc. is subject to statute and open for debate.)

Now, it is beyond the boundaries of reason that we criminally prosecute people to compensate for the fact that copyright holders/media corporations have wasted a decade trying to figure out how to deal with the internet. We've lost entire industries before (like the brick-and-mortar bookstore) because of technological innovation, and the US government doesn't arrest teenagers over it.

Nonetheless, I don't agree with the moral defense of "file-sharing". We don't have a Right to File-Share copyrighted material. To the extent that these labels issue a verdict on the act itself, it is something less than piracy, but something more than file-sharing. It would clearly be black market if there were any money in it.

I dunno... why am I wrong about this, internet?

[–]10tothe24th 1 point2 points ago

Tell that to TPB... or the Pirate Party. I agree that it's a loaded term, but file-sharers have embraced it, so--for better or for worse--it's here to stay.

[–]YaroLord 1 point2 points ago

Sharing something, money involved = piracy Sharing something, NO money involved = file-sharing

Period.

[–]axiom0 1 point2 points ago

Seriously?

I don't think anyone refers to legal file-sharing as piracy.

Illegal file-sharing can be called piracy. I'm not opposed to that. Is this just another "let's find an excuse to justify our ability to (illegally) obtain free stuff on the internet" thread?

[–]utorrent_programmer 1 point2 points ago

Let me just settle in, here. http://imgur.com/tCp90.gif

[–]kbox 1 point2 points ago

Calling it file sharing is obfuscating the issue. Nobody has a problem with sharing files, providing you have a right to share those files. i.e they're your own property or licensed under terms that allow it. "sharing" copyrighted material is piracy.

This isn't about open and available information. I never see reddit getting it's panties in a bunch over textbook sharing, it's always movies and music. You're trying to justify the theft of copyrighted media because you don't want to pay for spiderman 3, and you'd do yourselves a favour if you just admitted that instead of pretending you're on some nobel crusade for the freedom of knowledge and information.

[–]KnownAsRye 1 point2 points ago

Good ol' reddit. If a company steals an idea, they're total scumbags and should be abandoned forever. If someone steals (yes, steals, as they get a product and the maker gets nothing), they're a hero who should be lauded for sticking it to the man.

[–]KobeGriffin 1 point2 points ago

Yes, the irony is lost on the majority.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points ago

Whatever laws are trying to be past to fight against piracy are irrelevant; the fact of the matter is that piracy is illegal. Stop complaining and accept the fact that what you are doing is illegal. I'm saying this and even I pirate shit all the time.

[–]Bloodypalace 1 point2 points ago

Same shit, different toilet.

[–]Jisamaniac 1 point2 points ago

File-sharing is piracy...

[–]SiverVixon 1 point2 points ago*

I always wondered...what happened to consumers intellectual property rights? When I buy a car... car company's can't say not to let other ppl borrow my car. Why do software vendors get to say who can use software that I payed for? I guess if consumers had lawyers and lobbyist working for them, like music company's and software vendors and Hollywood. You guys would not be in this mess in the first place. As far as I'm concerned, they bent the laws in their favor, and expected to get away with it. Piracy is what happens when people with no lobbyist (99.9% of Humanity, you know the consumers) don't get there interest protected.

[–]istarian 1 point2 points ago

okay, but it's still illegal. :)

[–]YellowRedBlack 1 point2 points ago

I'd prefer there be some distinction between "file-sharing" the latest blockbuster movie, and "file-sharing" the latest Ubuntu iso. The last thing we need is for politicians to think that those are both the same thing.

[–]riomhaire 1 point2 points ago

No. I'll call it copyright infringement.

[–]columbine 1 point2 points ago

No thanks.

[–]nbca 1 point2 points ago

Let's stop calling it rape and let's call it "attack".

[–]bart2019 1 point2 points ago

FTFY: "unauthorized file sharing".

[–]holodog 1 point2 points ago

Digital swashbuckling.

[–]Or0ku_Saki 1 point2 points ago

Here is what I tell my students:

File-sharing gets it's roots from "tape trading". 20-30 years ago, you bought local zines' and imported copies of Kerrang! etc. In the back was a section just for people looking for particular music. It was like being pen pals, but you traded.

Now, for the kicker...the Feds and record companies knew all about it, and never batted an eye. Reason? It was on a small scale.

Here is my take on it --> I never thought tape trading was wrong. We were kids and had very limited resources (like most today!). I bought a tape, you bought a tape. We BOTH paid our fee. However, we did not have enough to buy two. So, we TRADED! Yah, the world is great. Plus, you would watch for the post with anticipation. Just like being a member of BMG or some other music purchase service. You could not wait for your new jams to show up in them post.

Music SHARING imo, is not a bad thing at all. I say this, also as a musician. If I release a product, It would be nice to get paid. I like to eat too, and pay bills etc. If two people share, and they both bought the original product then everyone is ponying up what is due. Fair enough.

Now, do I wish more music would be self released (similar to what Louis C.K just did with his DVD). Yes! Very much so.

Now...Pirating...that is another issue.

No matter how you cut it, it is theft. It's theft from programmers, etc.

The way I get around this? I support lots of Freeware, and ( duhn, duhn, duhn....) D.O.N.A.T.E.

Every single decent Freeware out there, has a donate link. Throw them 5-10 bucks for something you use a lot an enjoy.

Examples: 7-Zip, uTorrent, Mozilla, et. al.

I understand the concept of "sticking it to the man", etc. I don't like dishing out tons of cheddah to Adobe and the likes. Be reasonable, and fair. No one here would like someone stealing their stuff. Even if you believe that the makers have tons of cash, and won't miss your dime. They will. They have earned the right. If you don't like the expensive product, then go open source.

Sure, it's not always as easy, but you might just learn something cool in the process.

[–]LikeAFootballBat 1 point2 points ago

How about "the unauthorized illict file sharing of other people's intellectual property"?

I pirate shit all the time, it doesn't mean I feel the need to create euphemisms to rationalize the morality of my actions.

My point is, you can sugar coat it all you want but at the end of the day the act of unauthorized transfer of intellectual property is just as illegal when you call it "file sharing" as it is when you call it "piracy".

[–]Wulfpak1977 1 point2 points ago

My favorite is you end up paying 12,500% interest on the dvd you "stole" if you are caught. Who came up with the 250k fine for something that is worth 20 bucks? And on top of that why is jail time only related to big business copyright breaking from the average joe? I do not see people spending time in jail for breaking photo copy rights. Must be nice to have the GOV pass laws because you can bribe them to suite your agenda so easily. Copy Right enfringement is a civil not judicial law. The idea that college kid A is fined millions of dollars and placed on probation is absurd compared to the value they took through pirating.