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[–]Dooflegna 41 points42 points ago

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Community's been surprisingly consistent given its incredibly hectic, experimental nature. Sometimes, the experiments work exceptionally well, and sometimes they don't. But there are few episodes of Community so bad that they simply don't work at all.

Community's problem is that so many episodes are so exceptional that the bar is raised to a stupidly high level. It makes the 'average' episodes stand out in contrast.

Compare this to formulaic comedies where there's a very normal expectation of what you're going to watch and very little deviation in that quality. (The Big Bang Theory is a good example of this.) When you think of the Big Bang Theory, you think of its consistency. You don't think of 'defining' episodes that push the boundaries of the show's capabilities.

So to your point, yes, there are fluctuations in quality. But unlike an average bell curve of meh to good, Community's curve ranges average to out-of-this-world fantastic.

It makes for one heck of a ride.

[–]andrewms 21 points22 points ago

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When I think of The Big Bang Theory I think of their ridiculous abuse of the laugh track.

[–]neuromonkey 3 points4 points ago

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85% of the reason I can't stand to watch it.

[–]IHeartRegicide 10 points11 points ago

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The writing makes up the other 85%.

[–]kmcd151 3 points4 points ago

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math is hard sometimes

[–]bangslash 4 points5 points ago

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There is no laugh track on TBBT. It is a studio audience. Don't mean to argue semantics, I am not generally a fan of studios or laugh tracks. Though sometimes on TBBT the studio laughs so hard it is funny in-and-of itself.

[–]andrewms 5 points6 points ago

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Well whatever it is, it makes me want to punch Chuck Lorre in the face every time I hear it.

[–]RIPterriers 4 points5 points ago

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This is a fantastic answer. Is Community inconsistent when you hold it to the standard they obviously strive to uphold? A little, yeah.

They don't always nail the ridiculous combination of: hilarious one-liners; physical comedy; breakneck-pace dialogue; clever but not disorienting breaking of the 4th wall; using tropes to simultaneously acknowledge the plot they're using isn't wholly original, and then illustrate a creative way to go beyond the simple trope or combine multiple tropes; true character moments that both reassure the current perception of the character is true, then evolving that view; and heartfelt emotional storylines that show these characters, as ridiculous as it might have initially appeared, truly care for each other and think of each other as a sort of family.

Sometimes Pierce is a little too mean, or you can tell the plot was a bit too stitched-together with the patchwork and glue of hilarity, so they don't earn the emotional resolution as much as they could have. But when you compare it to 99% of the television that's being made right now, it routinely takes a big shit all over them.

[–]happyscrappyYam 1 point2 points ago

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Yeah, what he said.

I think the show does vary a bit more than other shows. But mostly the show just goes in many different directions and some of those directions don't please the same group of people as other directions do.

[–]comicstar 8 points9 points ago

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I agree that it has huge fluctuations in quality, but these range, in my opinion, from "great" to "OMFG HOW WILL ANYTHING I EVER SEE OR EXPERIENCE AGAIN BE ABLE TO COMPARE TO THIS?". I just rewatched my absolute least favourite episode, Troy's birthday... and it's not bad at all.

[–]StartingConversation 4 points5 points ago

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I have to agree. And it's important to remember subjectivity as well, because Troy's birthday was actually one of my favorite episodes. I like when the show sometimes goes touchy-feely, but that's just me.

I actually quite like the fact that not every episode pleases everyone. I like more that different episodes will have different elements to it that are mind-blowingly good for some people, rather than episode being sort of all right for everyone.

[–]comicstar 1 point2 points ago

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Since watching it last night, I've started to think that it might be one of my favourites as well. At the time I watched it for the first time, I was surprised by what a straightforward, unexemplary episode it was, but this time around picked up all these subtleties that I love even more for the fact I didn't get them the first time. Also it has Tig Notaro who, having seen in her in person now, I appreciate more for the sex goddess she is.

I strongly agree with your second paragraph and may bring it up in future discourse, with due credit given of course :)

[–]Tiak 1 point2 points ago

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That ep is in my top 5. It's probably less funny, sure, but it's also more significant. We explore each of the characters with a lot more depth, and through a different lens. I really like the idea of contrasting a night out with a day at school, and how even with the same group of people it can be a dramatically different experience.

[–]Splinter0991 13 points14 points ago

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Meh. I disagree. I personally have never found any episodes terrible.

[–]clownprince_ 0 points1 point ago

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It's all a matter of personal preference, really.

I agree with you, but then again.. I'm not impartial.

[–]neuromonkey 0 points1 point ago

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You're Boob-o-Tron 4000, aren't you?

[–]ill_be_back 3 points4 points ago

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With Community taking more chances ("fast-paced escapades") this second season, it was bound to happen that the episodes would be less consistent in terms of writing and dialogue quality. However, with great risk comes great rewards- the best of this season have been as good or better than the best of last season.

It really depends on whether you like the roller coaster ride of episode quality or not, because IMO if averaged out, the episode quality this season is definitely on par or better with last season.

[–]ill_be_back 3 points4 points ago

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Season 1:

Amazing: (Warfare, Poultry)

Great: (Halloween, Debate, April Fools Day, Christmas, RomExp)

Good: (Everything else)

Weak: (Jack Black?, Discourse? Even then I'm not sure)


Season 2:

Amazing: (BottleEp, Conspiracy, D&D, Memory,CritFilm, Documentary, and Paintball will be boss too)

Great: (Mixology, JesusFilm, Epidemiology, AeroofGender, Anthropology, Acct4Lawyers)

Good: (Everything else)

Weak: (Christmas, Winetasting, EastEuro)

Horrible: (Space, Pharmacology, Valentines)

[–]ShowMeUrrGenitals 6 points7 points ago

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Really the space one is considered horrible? "It's a sticker" made me laugh for a solid minute the first time I saw it.

[–]ill_be_back 2 points3 points ago

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the main reason i couldn't get into it was because it required a huge suspension of belief- Annie wanting to transfer because of a buttflag after what happened last season- that I could not make. it seemed like a SNL skit more than an episode (much like the pharmacology ep).

[–]clownprince_ 12 points13 points ago*

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The fact that you consider this years Christmas episode to be 'weak' really kills the credibility.

There was so much depth to it.. it made Abed a much more sympathetic character instead of the aloof kid he usually was.

I think most people write off the episode just because they didn't enjoy the claymation aspect, but I honestly feel that it's just as good as the D&D episode.. [same idea, group gathered around the table 'imagining' the story.. although the xmas episode takes it to a different level]

[–]ill_be_back 3 points4 points ago

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I might be in the minority here, but I really disliked that episode because it didn't feel like Community to me. It felt like the writers were so desperate to play with clay that they tossed in the story as a second thought. It had a few good bits, but the writing was sloppy, the jokes didn't really stick, and the emotion/sappiness/depth was literally forcefed to us. For a good emotional/profound episode, look no further than Mixology and CritFilm.

[–]deflective 0 points1 point ago

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I might be in the minority here

but you know you're not. not really.

since christmas we've had two or three people every month start a thread or post that they don't like the claymation episode.

[–]ill_be_back 0 points1 point ago

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haha maybe, but "i might be in the minority" is a great rhetorical opening to any argument. :P

[–]happyscrappyYam 0 points1 point ago

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I didn't really like it either. Different things for different people.

And I like animation a lot.

[–]super6logan -1 points0 points ago

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Claymation is my least favorite ep of all time.

[–]clownprince_ 0 points1 point ago

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that's good for you?

[–]super6logan 3 points4 points ago

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Not really, I'd prefer it if every ep was so good I didn't have a least favorite.

[–]bicoloredlemur 2 points3 points ago

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I don't know... IMO Art of Discourse is the worst episode. Far worse than space and valentines, and a tad bit worse than pharmacology.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points ago

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The Jack Black episode sold me on Community. I liked Jeff as Radar, and when Buddy was talking about how he didn't have the group's rhythm figured out yet and the intro cut across him I laughed so much.

[–]forbucci 0 points1 point ago

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two things man: 1) I am amazingly appreciative of you being on here and talking about your show after doing the AMA. giving it a real critique is awesome. 2) that you put your name as "donglover" instead of a possible "donaldglover" because frankly the only thing I see is "dong-lover" so thanks for that

[–]ill_be_back 1 point2 points ago

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lul.

Let me clear something up: as much as I wish I am, I am not Donald Glover. The mods just lovingly gave me this title :)

[–]forbucci 1 point2 points ago

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well fuck me sideways. now i feel like a fool. Still though "donglover"?

[–]ill_be_back 1 point2 points ago

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yeah i know. pretty awesome/lucky/insulting/horribly unlucky, right?

[–]SphericalArc 4 points5 points ago

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Honestly, while I agree that the anti-drugs skit episode was of a lower tier than the rest of the season, I'm pretty sure that's the ONLY episode of that tier. Season one had its "The Art of Discourse," season two had its "Celebrity Pharmacology". I'm okay with one episode per ~25 being of a slightly lower quality, especially considering that one episode is still better than most comedy on tv these days.

[–]Rinickulous 0 points1 point ago

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Am I missing what was not enjoyable about the anti-drug skit?

Pierce's antics in that episode cracked me up. Dildopolis. The very corny skit it was going to be and how he distorted it.

Britta: Hey look it's drugs with a crazy wig and sparklers...

Pierce: POOOOOOKEEEMOOONNNNN!!!!

Chang:I'm gonna deep fry your dog and eat your momma's face! And I'm gonna wear your little brother's skin like Pa-JAMAS!

It may be what some others said about maybe the timing was slower than other episodes, personally though it never stuck out to me as a lacking episode.

[–]SphericalArc 0 points1 point ago

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It's not that it wasn't enjoyable, it was... but it just didn't seem to match the clever writing of pretty much every other episode. I'll admit, it still had it's moments though. "Did someone say 'crazy person?'" is probably one of my favourite Chang lines.

[–]Rinickulous 0 points1 point ago

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fair enough

[–]DirtyHerring 2 points3 points ago

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As with every outstanding show you can't top last week's episode every time. But when you forget the extremely high standards that "The Contest", "The Puffy Shirt", "Modern Warfare", "Advanced Dungeons and Dragons" style episodes inspire, and imagine the "lesser" episodes in another show, you might agree, that they would definitely count as "better" episodes in the context of another sit com.

That satisfies my highest standards.

Season 2 has convinced me pretty much that if they can keep this quality, NBC might actually have found its next Seinfeld. But of course they would need to keep the number of Friends style episodes like last week low.

[–]ill_be_back 2 points3 points ago

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agreed. for the sake of ratings, they may need to do more crazy shenanigans, but for the sake of the overall quality of the show, it is very important that they maintain a good proportion of low-key "Friends-esque" episodes. Without them, A) we can't appreciate the crazy episodes, and B) the show becomes a huge caricature. It needs to stay grounded in the relationships between characters (after all, this is a character rather than plot driven sitcom) rather than doing 20 minutes of action sequences before slapping on a "but we still love each other" at the end.

[–]DirtyHerring 2 points3 points ago

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Don't get me wrong. I don't mind a little soap in my comedies, if it's done right.

What amazed me so far about this season was that they had lots and lots of hugging and learning and still managed to stay funny.

What bothered me (a little) about the last episode was that they had a soap main plot and most of the funny was almost completely unrelated to the story.

[–]_YourMom 2 points3 points ago*

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YES. It's one of my favorite shows on air right now, but god is it inconsistent.

I think as others have said, it's because the good episodes are really good.

[–]old_merc[S] 2 points3 points ago

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This is my exactly my stance.

[–]Ajinho 1 point2 points ago

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Mine also, but I find that I still like most of the weaker episodes more than some of the better episodes of other shows I enjoy.

Also, now that I re-read that sentence, I find it very confusing, but I'm not going to fix it, even though I could easily have done so in the amount of time it has taken to type this one.

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points ago

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DAE understand comedy is subjective?

[–]ill_be_back 10 points11 points ago

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yes, but im sure OP here is asking for opinions, not the answer to "Who's the Boss?" :)

[–]forbucci 0 points1 point ago

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who is the boss?

[–]ill_be_back 4 points5 points ago

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michael scott. y'all bitches just phyllis.

[–]sunsunsun 1 point2 points ago

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bruce springsteen. duh.

[–]old_merc[S] 5 points6 points ago

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No shit. What I'm wondering is whether other people share my subjective view?

[–]neuromonkey 1 point2 points ago

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No. It is not.

HA HA HA HA HA HA!!!

[–]digifreak642 1 point2 points ago

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Community hits higher highs than any comedy on television. However, shows like Parks & Rec are more consistent. However, I'm much more looking forward to rewatching all of Community's episodes.

[–]another_name 1 point2 points ago

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What? You mean that a production team that has to produce 22-25 30 minute story arcs in a year doesn't always deliver groundbreaking writing, acting, and comedy week-in, week-out?

Sheesh, name the show that had amazing episodes all the time, non-stop?Some episodes hit, and some miss. It's pretty close to impossible to not have fluctuations in quality, if only because all shows save their best stuff for Sweeps Week.

I'm thinking...deal with it?

[–]HannShotFirst 0 points1 point ago

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I personally don't think that the show has changes in quality, just in tone. There's obviously ones that are intended as comedic value, without much in the way of character development, and then there's those that flesh out the characters and give them a level of emotional depth I find surprising on a prime-time comedy like this.

[–]Waffl3copter 0 points1 point ago

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Yes.

[–]neuromonkey 0 points1 point ago

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Huh? No. I think that it's incredible how consistent and consistently funny the writing is.

[–]gregK 0 points1 point ago

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It has consistently surprised me.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point ago

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It most certainly fluctuates. It's just that not every episode can be Modern Warfare, Advanced D&D, etc.

[–]deflective 0 points1 point ago

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so you know, the phrase dae is irritating to a lot of people.
adding 'be honest' actually put my teeth on edge.

[–]old_merc[S] 0 points1 point ago

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Yeah regretted my wording after I posted it.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point ago

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Yes, but that's ok because Abed's birthday pulled the whole series up on average as a whole. Perhaps next season they'll crack it, but this season has been mostly consistent in quality. Last week's was ok, and in a few months when I'm watching through them all again it will seem fine. I think everyone's expectations are so high at the minute that a slightly worse episode like last weeks really seems bad in comparison when in fact it was still pretty good.

[–]brokencode 0 points1 point ago

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Yeah it can be totally awesome or cleverly decent. Of course it should be awesome all the time, but that's not realistic.

[–]rleclair90 0 points1 point ago

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I'd compare a bad episode of Community to a bad episode of Dexter. Yeah, it's disappointing given how great the show is when it wants to be, but a bad episode of either show is still better than 90% of everything else on TV on their best days.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point ago

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What, I loved the anti-drugs skit episode!

[–]MoldyPoldy -1 points0 points ago

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I thought the first season was pretty hit-or-miss. I really didn't think it was anything special, just above-average for a 22 minute show.

This season has been extraordinary, and I have loved pretty much every minute.